Moments when a piece of entertainment completely lost you.

Crissa · Post by **Crissa** » Wed Jun 09, 2010 1:20 am

Sammi and I have gotten some stern looks for breaking out in laughter at movies. Saving Private Ryan and Space Cowboy were a couple of the major ones. We got shushed and then had some words tossed at us after Saving Private Ryan.

But c'mon, the anime transformation sequence and the riding the nuclear bomb to the moon? That had to be intentional to laugh at.

-Crissa

Vnonymous · Post by **Vnonymous** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 5:43 am

PhoneLobster, saying that someone can go and turn it into their own personal piece of propaganda means exactly jack shit as to how "racist" something is. Someone could use your posting career to justify the extermination of the jews, and that wouldn't actually make you a racist.

Secondly, the story is an adaptation of an existing one. Considering that 300 was actually written before America got into the war with Iraq(well, the more recent one) and the current tensions with Iran, its' kind of hard to say that it was made about the current conflict. Given what it is an adaptation of, I find it even harder to believe that Herodotus was thinking of the US' actions in Iraq when he wrote The Histories.

Finally, assuming that the Spartans represent the US is completely backwards. The US military is actually a hell of a lot larger than the Iraq one, and definitely better equipped. Historically, the superpower was actually Persia, and the film glorifies, if anything, the heroic sacrifices of the Iraqi resistance fighters against the evil hordes of America.

Crissa · Post by **Crissa** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 5:55 am

Actually, while the US military is better equipped, it wasn't, to a man, 'larger' than the Iraqi armed forces. The US military may consume more dollars than every other military in the world combined... But it doesn't have as many soldiers as others.

I'm not even sure it's in the top ten.

-Crissa

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 6:15 am

Crissa wrote:Actually, while the US military is better equipped, it wasn't, to a man, 'larger' than the Iraqi armed forces. The US military may consume more dollars than every other military in the world combined... But it doesn't have as many soldiers as others.

I'm not even sure it's in the top ten.

-Crissa

It definitely is in the top ten in terms of man power. The United States is eighth in terms of numbers of troops. After China, North Korea, Vietnam*, India, Russia, Iran, and South Korea.

*: Note that in the case of Vietnam this is a completely bullshit number, because all it means is that they have mandatory enlistment in the national guard, and thus have five million people as reserve soldiers.

But yeah, the United States does not have the largest army in terms of manpower, nor do we spend the largest percentage of our GDP on our military. Even within NATO, both Greece and Turkey have a percentage GDP expenditure on military that makes us look like pacifists. It really is the elephant in the room as regards Greek Finances.

Zinegata · Post by **Zinegata** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 6:17 am

It's hilarious how people link 300 to the current world conflicts when the original graphic novel pre-dates said conflicts, and the battle which the graphic novel is based on pre-dates even movies.

And note: Greeks were pretty racist bastards back in the BC era. And Thermopylae had been laid down as their ultimate "Fuck you" to being assimilated by Persian culture.

Funnily, the Greeks of this era were also so puny and insignificant that Persian Kings needed to hire guys whose only job was to remind them that they ought to crush the upstart Greeks when their schedule freed up.

Should it be any surprise that a movie depicting Themopylae show the Persians in an extremely negative light? Depicting Persians as the good guys in any depiction of Thermopylae is like saying you should make a movie about the Holocaust where Nazis were heroic folks exterminating people to save the world from Communism.

Crissa · Post by **Crissa** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 6:28 am

FrankTrollman wrote:It definitely is in the top ten in terms of man power. The United States is eighth in terms of numbers of troops.

I didn't know where to look that up. I was pretty sure if you counted mercenaries and contractors under the US flag, that wouldn't have been even in doubt, but.

-Crissa

Neeeek · Post by **Neeeek** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:06 am

Vnonymous wrote:
Finally, assuming that the Spartans represent the US is completely backwards. The US military is actually a hell of a lot larger than the Iraq one, and definitely better equipped. Historically, the superpower was actually Persia, and the film glorifies, if anything, the heroic sacrifices of the Iraqi resistance fighters against the evil hordes of America.

Beyond that, the entire movie's basis of a fight between freedom and tyranny is insane from a historical perceptive. The Greeks (including the Spartans) had slaves. The Athenian enlightenment was built on the backs of slaves doing the labor so the rich could philosophize. The Greeks had democracies, but they only included certain people, and that wasn't most people. Hell, modern democracies have more in common with 17th century pirate ships than any other historical precursor.

Zinegata · Post by **Zinegata** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:35 am

The premise of 300 is that it's the story of Thermopylae being told by a Spartan. Who as sent home specifically because he could tell a good story.

Who's also trying to inspire his fellow Greeks to go kill Persians who outnumber them 3:1.

Yeah. I can totally see him saying "We are fighting for tyranny and slavery! We rescue the world from the light of enlightenment and freedom! For Leonidas, and the 300!"

300 is not a historical recreation or political commentary. It's Thermopylae as how the Greeks probably saw it. And it's also how most of the Western world views it as the said Western world tends to view the Greeks as the foundation of their civlization (ignoring the evil bits).

And it's a really, really simple story. 300 guys against 1,000,000. The 300 fucking win, if not in material terms (sure they all die but kill thousands of their enemies), but also in moral terms (they inspire their countrymen and make them believe the big bad horde can be beaten). Of course it's horribly biased in favor of the Greeks. But that's the *point*.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:18 am

Zinegata wrote:And it's a really, really simple story. 300 guys against 1,000,000. The 300 fucking win, if not in material terms (sure they all die but kill thousands of their enemies), but also in morale terms (they inspire their countrymen and make them believe the big bad horde can be beaten). Of course it's horribly biased in favor of the Greeks. But that's the *point*.

fixed that for you...

Zinegata · Post by **Zinegata** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:18 am

Prak_Anima wrote:
Zinegata wrote:And it's a really, really simple story. 300 guys against 1,000,000. The 300 fucking win, if not in material terms (sure they all die but kill thousands of their enemies), but also in morale terms (they inspire their countrymen and make them believe the big bad horde can be beaten). Of course it's horribly biased in favor of the Greeks. But that's the *point*.
fixed that for you...

Whoops. Thanks!

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:20 am

yeah, there's no way the spartans won anything in terms of morality. Morale, they were good at, especially carrot and stick morale (though possibly minus the carrot), but morality, at least as we know it, was kind of a foreign concept to most of the Hellens.

Zinegata · Post by **Zinegata** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:24 am

If we're gonna be real strict about it, Hellens do have "morals". They are just completely foreign to our own.

What we see as pedophilia they saw as totally cool and moral. So yes, let's stick to morale else we start going into the "boy lovers" quip by Leonidas.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 10:27 am

you mean this thread doesn't "need more dogrape"?

Zinegata · Post by **Zinegata** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 1:02 pm

Prak_Anima wrote:you mean this thread doesn't "need more dogrape"?

I missed the reference.

violence in the media · Thu Jun 10, 2010 1:31 pm

Please, no more dogrape.

Lago PARANOIA · Post by **Lago PARANOIA** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 5:08 pm

For fans of WONDERMARK!!!

Why does the author of that webcomic hate Kevin Smith movies so much? He's made three swipes at those movies so far, so I'm wondering if there is just something I'm not seeing?

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 8:30 pm

because most of his movies, while saying interesting things, are kind of terrible movies about assholes?

Username17 · Post by **Username17** » Thu Jun 10, 2010 8:33 pm

He was in Daredevil?

-Username17

Lago PARANOIA · Post by **Lago PARANOIA** » Sat Jun 12, 2010 4:44 am

I'm starting to come under the uncomfortable realization that Josh of the Comics Curmudgeon is a hack.

I have that same vibe of discontent and malaise from reading this strip right now as I did right before I found out that Scott Adams was a victim of the Salem Hypothesis, when I stopped fooling myself about Star Wars Episode I a couple of days after I watched that movie, and halfway into my Ren and Stimpy collection when I realized that the show was never really funny.

Crissa · Post by **Crissa** » Sat Jun 12, 2010 5:36 am

Gosh, movies about people like you. What's not to love?

Smith knows lots of people who are seriously broken, and writes movies about them. It shouldn't be surprising.

-Crissa

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Sat Jun 12, 2010 6:04 am

<looks up Salem Hypothesis>

That's just bizarre...

Crissa · Post by **Crissa** » Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:13 am

You know, Maj, we already had one thread on this and danged if I can't find the one that went off the rails.

If that's new to you, I'm not sure where you've been.

-Crissa

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Sat Jun 12, 2010 8:52 am

Crissa wrote:Gosh, movies about people like you. What's not to love?

Smith knows lots of people who are seriously broken, and writes movies about them. It shouldn't be surprising.

-Crissa

mature.

But hey, I'll admit it, I like a good asshole who somehow refrains from the urge to kill every person on earth. It helps to have a character you identify with, you know?

Count Arioch the 28th · Sat Jun 12, 2010 12:50 pm

I don't care much for Kevin Smith movies as a whole. He has done a couple that I liked though, and he seems to be a likable guy so I don't hate on him.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Sat Jun 12, 2010 9:34 pm

I don't hate on him either, really. I find most of his movies entertaining, which is really all I look for when I watch a movie, whether or not I'm entertained.